Former Lilian Baylis site and difficult hustings questions

I promised yesterday that I'd post about the former Lilian Baylis site and political parties. The history of the topic is now tedious and long. The reason it's so important in the local election is that there is both considerable support in favour, and considerable consternation against the All Nations Church (ANC) bid to own the former Lilian Baylis site. Nobody is talking much about that because nobody knows exactly how many ANC constituents there are in Princes ward (to gain votes from if one supports the proposals), or exactly how many LGBT votes one would lose in Prices ward by supporting the ANC ownership possibility. So it's a bit of a problem for the local candidates.

There are a number of questions that I suggest the public ask at potential hustings:
1. Do you support the bid of the ANC to own and act as lead partner at the former Lilian Baylis site?

This is the key question. Labour (so far) appear to be supporting this end, and are thus likely to garner the support of the ANC when it comes to winning votes, but are they doing so by sacrificing the LGBT populace opinion? On the other hand, would the Lib Dems, Conservative or Green party really be able to do any better?

2. How would you respond to the fears of the local LGBT community who are concerned about a public asset landing in the hands of an organisation that (whilst currently respectful towards them) might struggle to hold that homosexuality is a sin, at the same time as welcoming LGBT meetings at a public space?

3. Do you consider it better for the site to be held in trust with a local organisation or for it to be owned by a group, such as the ANC, outright?

4. What form of oversight would you like to see put in place to ensure that a former council building remained in inclusive community use?


5. At a time when council house rents are rising (and housing is scarce), is it possible for the site to be partially sold off for public use, at the same time as redeveloped for ANC, Ethelred and SAZ use?

See below for a very potted history. I'm just quoting some of the main bits that I've found, but I'll elaborate if any commentator says I've forgotten anything major.

1. In January 2005, the Lilian Baylis School moved to a new building.

2. The Lambeth Council Unitary Development Plan (proposed by the Lib Dem council in 2005, but published by Labour unchanged in 2007) says of the former LB site: "(b) Appropriate proposals for the Grade II listed Lilian Baylis school and its grounds would be supported... to enable redevelopment of the site for a mix of uses, including a mixed tenure housing scheme, community and leisure uses."

Labour welcomed the idea, in 2007 (proposed by the Lib Dems), that the site might be used for (amongst other things), housing. There were some older proposals for the site under the Lib Dems (which did support demolition of it), but these were not approved by the Lib Dem Council of the time and the above Lib Dem proposal went through unchanged by Labour.

3. Lambeth Council community consultation published by external agency in February 2006. Unfortunately, response rate was only about 17% and local people wanted the site to be used for leisure, housing (public, not private) and community purposes.

4. On 16th March 2006, the RCDT reported breakthroughs made at the Area Committee meeting by the then local Lib Dems who argued in favour of:
"a. Keeping part of the Lilian Baylis site for community and sports facilities for local people
b. Keeping a gymnasium if possible- and all potential purchasers to consider keeping the gym
c. Money from the sale of the site to go to new recreation centre and swimming pool in North Lambeth
d. Further consultation with local people about what’s on offer and what’s best for the community
e. A local project board, including residents and local groups, to oversee community provision on the site"

5. The "breakthrough" terminology used by the RCDT was disputed by Labour's Sam Townend (the naughty one) , who argued that an Area Committee can't make decisions, that the statements were ambiguous, that there was no "breakthrough" and the RCDT was being party political. The RCDT then requested a statement from Sam about the Labour position (this is made in March 2006, and involves two councillors still in position in 2009):

"‘We are committed to retaining and enhancing the current community, leisure and sporting uses of the site and adding to it educational and other social uses of the site by and for local people. Importantly the retention for the use by the community of the three gyms and sports hall. We want to see an expansion of the uses of the site by local people including potentially by Ethelred nursery..., use of the education facilities...... and the Sports Action Zone, and the large number of other local community organisations... We won’t allow the loss of the open playing spaces if at all possible. This does not mean that the site necessarily has to remain or entirely remain in the ownership of the Council. My preference would be for ownership to be transferred to a Community Trust, run and managed by local people. This obviously depends on if there is sufficient interest and commitment from people to carry out this work.... We would also like to see Ethelred TMO residents play a role in such a Trust as the site is in the middle of their estate."

6. Elections were held in May 2006. All three Lib Dem councillors were voted out. 3 new Labour councillors were voted in. Until May 2006, Lambeth Council (Lib Dems / Conservatives) apparently wanted to sell off the former Lilian Baylis School site on Lollard St. However, it does appear (above) that despite wanting to sell it off, they also wanted to retain it for use by local people.

7. On 17th March 2008, the Lambeth Council (Labour) agreed: "that All Nations Centre be placed ‘at the centre of any development at Old Lilian Baylis as a lead partner with security of tenure on an appropriate part of the site consistent with their needs.’" Quite an important statement, but nothing is said about ownership.

8. The Council (Labour) declared in January 2009 that it has chosen 3 "partners". These are: All Nations Church, Ethelred Nursery and Sports Action Zone (SAZ). It's leaflet is sketchy. It does not mention any issues related to ownership, governance or oversight. It does not mention relations with local community organisations. It has lost sight of many of the original organisations that might once have been involved. Are the Ethelred TMO still involved?

I made a mistake here in thinking that Mark Harrison (Labour) was attempting to save the site from the Council's plan in January 2009 and do something new (that was my error), but he has asserted here that he is campaigning in support of ongoing Labour council plans, and is concerned that, "The Lib Dems have recently been heard to be talking about selling off the site and abandoning the negotiations to set up a community trust to buy the site.". I've asked for clarification on that point, and I doubt we'll know any more until the Lib Dems answer their questions.

It's all rather unfair on Mark because he's the only one publically proposing any substantive policy so it looks as though I'm picking on him, which I don't intend to do.

Phewww.... sheer exhaustion has set in... Quite frankly, I'm surprised that four years have passed (part Lib Dem control, part Labour control), and that nothing appears to have happened. The current Council has proceeded with their campaign despite only a 16% community response to their consultation.

Have any readers got far enough to make any comments?

Final candidate - Janus Polenceus is English Democrat candidate

All Princes ward candidates had to submit their nominatons by 5pm this evening, and it appears that the fifth (and final) contender for the seat in the 2009 election is Janus Polenceus for the English Democrats. I'd not heard of the party until tonight, but I'm one of those people who always gets a little nervous about the use of the St George cross in political campaigns. Still... I promised to remain non-partisan, so I await Janus Polenceus' policy suggestions for Princes Ward with interest.

Tomorrow, I intend to throw a few comments into the ring re. the former Lilian Baylis site in SE11, as it's something of a political hot potato and Mark Harrison (Labour) has today made a useful clarification about his position (I might possibly have wrongly represented him, so I shall rectify that), but it's late now and time to catch some Zzzs.

I've still had no response from any of the first three candidates who should have received an email of my questions about their strategies for the area. Tomorrow, I shall chase for those and email the two new chaps who have entered the race today.

Green candidate for Princes Ward

I've been asking about this for a few weeks now, but the good old folks in the Twittersphere have apparently announced a Green party candidate (just in time, it would seem) for the Princes Ward by election. The candidate is Joseph Healy.

It's great that there are so many candidates.

He even has a blog with its own posts here already. Early comments? I like the fact that he has agreed to appear at hustings organised by the Lambeth Disability Forum. I saw a request for the Tory candidate to attend the same forum, so it will be interesting to know who attends. You won't keep me away if it's open to the public! However, I have heard that some of the other candidates have tried to organise public hustings too, so it would be sensible to do that soon...

I'm not too sure whether it's publically permissible to "out" candidates these days, even if they're not closeted... I think I'd be asking a few questions about the wisdom of that, considering the smear campaigns that have been conducted previously against gay candidates in the ward, but what's said is said. It would appear that we have a very pink line up of candidates for this election (which may well be representative of the ward... it certainly appears that way in Tesco).

Our green candidate certainly seems to be promoting Vauxhall City Farm, so one presumes (from the comments yesterday about John Roberts (Lib Dem) long relationship with the farm) that he and John will have lots to talk about! Joseph appears not to live in Prince's Ward, but then I don't think one should consider that a hindrance because it's hardly as though Camberwell is far away.

I'd love to know who his commentator "Princes" is because there are rather a number of interesting alibis appearing in the SE11 related blogosphere at the moment.

Lambeth Council - "Check the label" campaign

In case you thought that the SE11 youths of Lambeth were a singular mass of menace and nuisance, 24dash reports that Lambeth Council have launched a campaign (named "check the label") to tell you otherwise. That means that if you see any scary looking people on posters, you can read the text next to their faces and be reassured that they just look scary, but are in fact fine, upstanding citizens. So that's alright then!

Less than 3% of Lambeth youth is (apparently) involved in crime (those would be the ones they've caught), so our local youth need Lambeth Council's backing to improve their image. I still wonder why these aspiring youth need to look as menacing as they appear to in the photographs. I'm presuming that all of this local area blogging is turning me into a social conservative, and that I've aged before my time, but really! Why aren't there any young smiling people? And more importantly, where are the black women with the "aspiring" labels on them? It may be that the selection of four photographs on the Young Lambeth website is not representative of the entire campaign and I know that one can't seek to represent everybody, but I think it's a question worth asking.

I didn't know about the existence of the Young Lambeth website until today, but it seems like a new initiative. Let's hope it doesn't go the sad sorry way of the Lambeth LGBT forum which doesn't seem to have had its meeting dates updated since 2007, has a defunct "discussion board" forum, a distinct lack of information in the Police Update Board section amd no up and coming events. What is our council tax being spent on?

This is terrible, I seem to be becoming the resident whinger of SE11.

Princes Ward election - registration and housekeeping

I've been so busy keeping up with the gossip news about the local candidates that I utterly failed to remind fellow SE11 lurkers that it is necessary to register in order to be able to vote in the upcoming local (Princes Ward) and European elections. There's a handy site here that will allow you to change your address from a previous address and print out a form to send off to your local council.

Also, to make life easier for you all, I added a box (see the right hand side of the blog) which means that you can now subscribe by email. Just enter your email address, and then click on the email you receive to confirm that you are who you say you are. You'll receive an email each time I update the blog, in case you haven't got a handy feed reader set up.

John Roberts / Lib Dems answer their detractors

Yesterday, I mentioned that there had been some possible slurs on the Lib Dem candidate for Princes Ward, John Roberts, left by an anonymous commentator on this post.

This morning, I've been left lots of comments by people assuring readers that John does not live in Whitstable, that he is resident on the Ethelred Estate and has been for 15 years, but that he does have family in Whitstable. Also, in the unlikely event that you believed that he was kicked off the Metropolitan Police Authority by Boris, the commentator notes that this was not the case. He resigned from local committees, apparently because he needed a rest after 20 years. Sounds fair to me.

In addition, other commentators have suggested that the negative slurs in fact originate from the Labour party. I'm not sure that there's really enough information to say one way or another because all commentators have made anonymous comments or posted with their first name only. Since this is a non-partisan blog, I will report on comments as I see fit, but I don't really want to see any more unsubstantiated criticisms of opposition parties for the sake of it (it's tedious for the rest of us!).

However, since there is currently a dearth of policy information for Princes Ward by both Lib Dem and Conservative candidates, it seems worth posting three more charitable comments left by readers over the past few weeks about both John Roberts and Mark Harrison:

1. One commentator (Zara) says of John Roberts, "I first met john when he was volunteering at kennington park estate community centre (in 1989) my son went to the youth club and john raised money to open the centre more nights. He then became chair of vauxhall City farm. He personally raised 20k to keep the farm open a few years back. i dont think its all about going to commitee meetings, but actually doing the work. you talk to anyone that is involved in the farm and you will know that a lot of his work is not known about. He was also chair of the vauxhall ridding for the disabled and raised enough money to buy a few horses through sponsorship schemes. (do people know that??) I bumped into him at christmas at the farm where he had been organising the christmas festival in lambeth as a volunteer. (and still living on the Ethelred) He said that his dad died which is why he was taking some "time out".Then i meet him again at the local KA bazzer this year making tea in the kitchen, for people. Some of us might not like his politics, but you cant knock him for not giving a huge amount back to the local community."

2. One commentator (Nicky Johnson) says of Mark Harrison: "I really hope Mark Harrison is the Labour candidate - he is very active around SE11, and has been for several years.". Another commentator (Rita Pobson) says of Mark Harrison: "I guess it was to be expected given how much he's been doing locally, but it's good news all the same. Mark is a really genuine guy, even though he does look about twelve..."

Somebody must have something positive to say about what Michael Poole-Wilson has achieved in the local area! I've been receiving much higher than expected queries for his name in my Google analytics (considering that the area is a Labour/Lib Dem strong hold) so we're in for a very interesting election indeed.

By the way candidates/political parties, I want your intended positive policy intentions for Princes Ward, which I will then comment on as I see fit (see yesterday's post). I'm not interested in reporting information that just slags off the other party because it's far too easy to conduct local politics in such an uncharitable manner and it does a disservice to local residents. I sent out emails to candidates direct (or a representative from your party), and I've not had any response to the questions asked yet.

Madeira Day in Kennington Park

Due to leaving SE11 momentarily over the Bank Holiday, I missed the fact that there was a Madeira Day celebration in Kennington Park on Saturday. Since Lambeth has a very high proportion of Portuguese residents (and very welcome they are too), we are the fortunate beneficiaries of Portuguese food, drink and festivals. However, I can't figure out what Madeira Day is a celebration of exactly... Is it just the place?

Fortunately, the Mayor of Lambeth was there, and has recorded the day (along with photos) on his blog in full. It looks quite busy! I found some other photos on Flickr, taken by somebody else that attended.

That will teach me not to leave London... It looks like a lot of fun, but I failed to see it advertised anywhere before I left. I wonder whether it's annual?

Questions for political candidates in Princes Ward

One of the difficulties with the literature that floods through the door at election campaign time is that much of it just slags off an existing political party without putting forward any type of positive campaign. I'm never interested in how the existing party has underperformed. I want to know what the candidate intends to do that will result in positive change.

Usually, the literature is in no way comparable. I've decided to address this issue by sending the following questions/email to those who are standing in the by election, and will publish the results as soon as I receive them...

Dear Three main representatives

I would like to request you pass on the following questions to the candidates in your party who are standing in the Princes ward by election.

I wish to publish the answers to your candidates' questions on my blog, http://southeasteleven.blogspot.com/

1. Name the three main policies that you will make your platform for election in Princes Ward, eg. crime/transport/street care/environment etc. and highlight the strategies that you intend to undertake to implement the policies. Do not mention any of the opposing political parties in your answer.

2. What, if any, organisation(s) have you been involved with which demonstrate your commitment to the area, and how long have you lived/worked locally?

3. How will you demonstrate that you intend to serve the youth and older residents in Princes ward?

4. How will you demonstrate that you intend to serve those of low, modest and high income in Princes ward?

5. Name one issue that your political party advocates with which you strongly agree.(To demonstrate fidelity to your party and show why you are a member of your chosen political party)

6. Name one issue that your political party advocates with which you personally disagree.(To demonstrate independence of thought and refusal to be tied to party line)

7. Please highlight your views on the ongoing property development in Princes Ward and the SE11 area.

Princes Ward elections - Political party watch

A quick roundup of where we are with the upcoming election:

1. Conservative candidate = Michael Poole-Wilson

Michael appears not to have his own website, but there's a new item about his selection on the Lambeth Conservative website here with a lovely comment from his mother, assuring us all that he grew up in the area. I'm not hugely sure that the campaign a photograph taken outside the Prince's Arms in Cleaver Square is the best way to appeal to the entire electorate in Princes Ward. As much as I am a fan of the pub, it might be deemed slightly exclusive. Cleaver Square is decidedly posh Kennington, but somebody has to campaign to keep those pint prices down.

Also, what manifesto is Michael actually putting forward? I'm not sure that being passionate about civil liberties is enough for Lambeth. Is there any more online literature of which I'm not aware? Any online literature will be brutally attacked and pulled apart (see below).

2. Labour candidate = Mark Harrison

Mark Harrison is definitely winning in the online presence stakes, since his party have their own blog. In case you've not seen the piece on his election, it's here on the Princes Ward labour blog and they've had lots of time to take photos. However, we think that Labour have a distinct advantage in that they've known that naughty Sam Townend was likely to stand down, and have had Mark as their "shadow" placement for quite some time now.

Anyhow, yesterday, whilst we were all enjoying the sun (or not), Mark was busy whipping up his anti-crime manifesto, which can be found here. A few comments...? Yes, I think so.

a. Who will actually be charged with putting the tags /on/ the dangerous dogs? Would you volunteer? If they're dangerous, they shouldn't exist in the first place. Do we wait for them to attack, and then tag them? Sounds a bit dubious to me. Is there an actual dangerous dog tagging procedure in place anywhere else in the country?

b. Where is Mark going to get the money to get the CCTV on the estates working again? I don't believe in money until I'm told what budget it will come from and who will authorise its release.

c. I will warn /anybody/ in this campaign right now to steer well away from anything related to the former Lilian Baylis School because I'm going to sit here behind my keyboard shouting "rhethoric" very loudly. Why?

The current Labour council have already declared their partners in the school to be: All Nations Church (ANC), Sports Action Zone (SAZ) and the Ethelred Nursery. That's public information, declared in February 2009 and found here. Any youth work will be ANC or SAZ related, but there isn't a "Plan B" for the former Lilian Baylis School, and the project is already quite advanced. Just try speaking with the council officer in charge of the project. The partners have been chosen, and that's that. Some of us are keen to know how the project will hold together, but if you have any more info, please inform me. So... What exactly does Mark propose when he suggests "Saving" the former Lilian Baylis?

d. I hardly think that Labour (or any political party) can act to prevent drug dealing in Lambeth. I presumed that that was up to the police.

e. I really like the idea of saying "no" to Boris' police cuts. See below, but it looks as though Mark is campaigning to prevent more job losses, which makes it look as though Mark is campaigning to prevent John losing his job!

In his favour, Mark actually does appear to have some policies, and to have given them some independent thought.

3. Liberal Democrat candidate = John Roberts

John appears not to have his own website, but there's a news item about his selection on the Vauxhall Lib Dem website here.

An anonymous contributor on the blog has written that they are surprised at John's standing because they have asserted that John might live in Whitstable and that he was kicked off the "MPA"? (I'm guess Metropolitan Police Authority) by Boris. It sounds like the slurs have begun. I've tweeted for a response from John, since the Lib Dems say that John lives on the Ethelred, but have so far heard nothing.

It seems to me that the Lib Dems are are a bit slow on the uptake with their campaign. Labour (if Twitter is to be believed) have been out canvassing for weeks. Let's have some firm and clear policies set out please, as it looks as though Labour have something of a head start, and one man campaigns are always rather tedious to report... I need something interesting to pick apart and since I've given Mark Harrison a good grilling, I need to give John Roberts a thorough roasting.

4. We've had no response from the Green Party in Lambeth to say whether there's anybody standing and I don't know whether there are any independents. Does anybody else know?

81 Black Prince road appeal

I mentioned the attempt by a developer to gain planning permission to place a very tall building (23 storeys) in SE1 on the site of 81 Black Prince Road here back in January this year (2009). Interested parties can look up reference 08/04454/FUL on the Lambeth planning database. It is of interest to lurkers about SE11 as it is very close to the postcode boundary, and most Kennington (and some Vauxhall) residents will over look it.

At one point, I thought I might have a vested interest in seeing this application fail, but that is no longer the case. I do, however, continue to object on the basis that the building will not enhance the local area, and will set a precedent for building higher on the Albert Embankment. (You can see from the image below that Salamanca Tower is quite high enough). The building would dominate the landscape, looking from South London towards North London, and it would begin to close off the river for everybody that lives south of the Albert Embankment. It has been argued that there are taller developments in Vauxhall, but I think they're significantly far away that they should not count as a precedent for the 81 Black Prince Road site.

I failed to mention that the first attempt at planning permission was denied on 11/2/2009. The minutes to the planning meeting can be found here.

If you consult the minutes, you'll see that it was a close call. The permission was only, eventually, rejected on grounds of:

1. The harm that would be caused to the setting of the World Heritage Site,
2. Impact on the setting of listed buildings and adjoining conservation areas;
3. Poor quantity and quality of the proposed amenity space.
4. Overbearing impact of the proposed development and the creation of a sense of enclosure.

Unfortunately, the developers are appealing the decision made not to grant permission.

An appeal was lodged on 6/4/2009 and can also be found in the Lambeth Planning Database under reference 09/00048/FULREF.

Unfortunately, the appeal papers don't appear to have been uploaded to the database in this instance, so I've written to the Town Planning Advice Centre to request them.

I've been informed that any submissions from the public (which I believe have to refer to the conditions for refusal) (items 1 to 4) have to be submitted by 18/5/2009.

Submissions have to be sent to the Planning Appeals inspectorate in Bristol in triplicate to the following address:

The Planning Inspectorate, PO Box 326, Bristol, BS99 7XF.

Also, they have an online appeal process that can be accessed here.


I found an image from skyscrapercity.com alt="81 Black Prince Road outline"which I've pasted below, so that you can get a view of scale and some idea about how the external structure would look:

Oluwaseyi Ogunyemi (Seyi) named as victim in Larkhall Park murders

The BBC report that the Larkhall Park murder victim has been named as Oluwaseyi Ogunyemi (known as Seyi). Stockwell news is providing timely updates, so I'd recommend checking there first for more information.

My thoughts and prayers go to Seyi's family and friends.

Bakerloo line extension to Camberwell

Further to my post yesterday about the possible death of Crossrail, the Camberwell Online Blog has Tweeted about an article in Transport Briefing which once again raises the possibility of extending the Bakerloo line to Camberwell (a no brainer, since the station in Camberwell already exists) and also to Lewisham (which would be very exciting). Also, it mentions the idea of extending the DLR from Lewisham to Hayes. That's a new one to me, but would also be a great development.

Just one question... From whence cometh the money?

John Roberts - Lib Dem candidate

I've just heard that a man named John Roberts is the Lib Dem candidate for Princes Ward.

I can't seem to find much online presence for him (same with Michael Poole-Wilson), but it appears that he was/is a director of Vauxhall City Farm according to the RCDT website here. Also on the RCDT site, somebody called John Roberts (am assuming the same one) won a Lambeth Civic Award for promoting equality in Lambeth, for work related to the police.

The battle will presumably hot up from here on in, but you'll hear the news from Lurking about SE11 first... :)

I still want to know if there are any other candidates from green or independent parties standing. Please drop me a comment/email if you know anything.

Cross River Tram is dead. Crossrail might die. Long live the tube?

I made reference, yesterday, to the fact that Lambeth Council had mentioned the Cross River Tram in their Local Development Framework. I think, perhaps, that they forgot to remove it from the document because I doubt (sadly) that the scheme will ever come to fruition.

Today though, I spotted a rather interesting article article in the Evening Standard. The writer, Simon Jenkins, suggests that Boris should kill off Crossrail. Unfortunately, due to the nature of the "limited pot" (now "empty pot") of public money, one always knows that some Londoners will benefit through certain initiatives whilst others won't benefit at all (or will even become worse off). The Crossrail project is one example of a piece of transport that doesn't benefit South London at all. Due to my love of all things public transport, I'm not in a position to oppose it, but Simon's article has made me wonder... Apparently, TfL are close to bankruptcy, and unlikely to stump up their share of cash for Crossrail. If Boris were to eradicate the Crossrail project to plug the hole in his transport budget, Simon wonders whether he'd choose to plough that money into the tube.

The spare money in the pot from ditching Crossrail would be £5.6 billion.

And it was only the other day, (reported in Southwark News here) in early March at the London Assembly that Boris suggested "the potential of extending the Bakerloo Line for instance... is something we should drag onto the agenda". Do we think that any of the spare £5.6 billion could be channelled towards improving the tube connections in South London? It would be great to connect Camberwell, Peckham, Lewisham, Croydon and Brixton. How much does it cost to add tube stations and extend the lines? It certainly wouldn't cost that much to re-open Camberwell tube since the infrastructure is in already.

That would be a project which would mean South Londoners could stop asking "What has Boris ever done for us?"

Stockwell stabbing incident in Larkhall Park SW8

There was considerable helicopter noise around Stockwell last night, which is explained by the reports that two men were stabbed in Larkhall Park. A teenage boy has died. One other male is injured.

The police/media don't seem to have reported many details yet. Stockwell news quotes The Evening Standard, which suggests that the stabbings were part of local gang violence. The BBC have a report which offers little extra detail, along with a video of the taped off area that must have been shot last night. The Press Association say that four men are being held in connection with the stabbing.

The stabbing is some way outside the SE11 patch in SW8, but I've had various google queries here this morning from people looking for information.